18 replies to this topic

[AllStarZ]

Answer the question.

[Whitey]

0

-Rorschach

[WNxMastrefubu]

depends how large the crowd is

[Rai]

And it depends on who are they inside the crowd?

[BeefJeRKy]

Individuals lead the crowd.

[Darkfire Angel]

S, where S is the size of the crowd. Individuality is defined, at least partially by Others. Thus while people may be part of the group, and conform to it, it's also part of their Other and internalized concept of self.

[Libains]

None of them are individuals, but they are all an individual. Each person in a crowd is not specifically an individual, influenced as they are by the surrounding people, from their movement to their mood. However, the crowd itself behaves as a single organism, or an individual, much like shoals of fish or tribes of ants. Hence, you could argue it either way.

[CommanderJB]

All of them. People still choose whether they want to go along with the crowd or not, and though there is obviously sociological pressure to do so, being a member of a crowd does not excuse you from your actions or personality.

[Libains]

I would disagree with that, to an extent (sorry JB know you're tired). Immense sociological pressures do funny things to the miind and can leave it so that you think that the crowd is correct in what the crowd does, hence you become a follower of that crowd, and while not losing responsibility for your actions, it does make you very susceptible to not making your own choices anymore. To further that, when a crowd is in full throw, such as during a concert, there is no single leading individual in the crowd - the leader is the person encouraging them up on stage. Hence, the crowd has lost all sense of individualism, and is instead in-tune to what the person on stage wants, as a single mind.

[Darkfire Angel]

@AJ You're talking about Group think, and while yes it the social and mental pressures of a group does lead to individuals taking actions that they would otherwise disagree with, it still doesn't create a single group mind as you said. The individual still exists, but they identity themselves in relation to the group they're within.
The whole concept of group and individual identity can be argued either way and it's easy to mistake the theories put forward as excuses for group behaviour, part of the reason I shy away from it in my studies.

[TheDR]

The people in large colorful hats.

[Pav:3d]

^This isnt SYD?

JB pretty much nailed it imo

Edited by Pav3d, 06 March 2009 - 13:42.

[TheDR]

Pav3d, on 6 Mar 2009, 13:42, said:

^This isnt SYD?

JB pretty much nailed it imo

Nope thats what i think, if someone has a massive colourful hat, there really look individual.

It could also work for other items of clothing. I have found a flaw in my statement tho, if you were at a colourful hats festival you are more likely to be noticed if you don't have a colourful hat.

[Destiny]

Everyone of them is sentient, conscious. They're all doing different things, thinking of different things, drinking/eating different things. HOWEVER, unless it's the Japanese prank where a hundred people swarm this guy, someone shouts DANGER and all of them ducks, including the former "individual"...nope, they're all seperate entities.

Humans tend to be copycats. Well, at least in danger.

[Major Fuckup]

Scope, on 6 Mar 2009, 14:21, said:

Individuals lead the crowd.

i disagree its the blind leading the blind if you were an Individual you wouldn't be mixed in the crowd any way you would be walking where you want to walk dress in what you like and listen to the music you want to, that there shows character.
think about being in a protest over somethin a few trouble makers make trouble people around you are like cool man and join in you join in as well for the fun and start braking shit because your a sheep if those instigators weren't there it still be a protest still instead of a riot no one leads the group they only create then it dies and some one else makes a group and hello we are off again.

[CommanderJB]

AJ, on 6 Mar 2009, 19:36, said:

I would disagree with that, to an extent (sorry JB know you're tired). Immense sociological pressures do funny things to the miind and can leave it so that you think that the crowd is correct in what the crowd does, hence you become a follower of that crowd, and while not losing responsibility for your actions, it does make you very susceptible to not making your own choices anymore. To further that, when a crowd is in full throw, such as during a concert, there is no single leading individual in the crowd - the leader is the person encouraging them up on stage. Hence, the crowd has lost all sense of individualism, and is instead in-tune to what the person on stage wants, as a single mind.

Now my brain is back to functioning at its normal capacity, my response would be this; whether or not you are in a crowd, you still regard yourself as yourself. Both legally and physically you remain an individual for a very good reason. To treat members of crowds as not themselves is to disregard the fact that it is their choice to be in the crowd and their choice to follow it. While I don't debate that the human brain is 'wired' as a totally social organism and to resist the pull of a crowd requires extreme effort, an external influence on your mental state does not remove your individuality from you and it is still, in the end, the individual that determines the actions of the crowd. It is a symbiotic relationship; neither can exist without the other, just as neither removes the other.

[Destiny]

Unless your self-esteem is extremely high and your ego has been boosted to like "OMFGIMSOFAMOUSIDONTNEEDTOFOLLOWHATOTHERSDO", you're likely to just follow what the crowd does, albeit suddenly, to try to not be the odd-one-out or something. Oh, those with no self-esteem and no ego also probably won't be following a crowd.

And it depends on the type of crowd, location, weather etc. Pillow fight crowds...well that I won't explain.

[Overdose]

Honestly I wouldn't do everything the crowd does when it involves illegal activity unless that crowd is doing morally correct activity. I'd only have a crowd mentality in a some sort of protest I can agree with such as an anti-war protest.

[G-sus]

everyone is individual.
by looking at just a few attributes of the individuals the number of "non-individuals" is rising proportionally to the excluded parameters.
also being part of a crowd does change the individuals perspectives on matters the crowd is about.




EDIT: also, never forget the 2 rules about individuality:
Rule 1
Rule 2

Edited by G-sus, 07 March 2009 - 18:14.