21 replies to this topic

[Libains]

This is something I've been mulling over for a bit, and recently, having seen others mention the same thing, thought it might make for interesting discussion.

The question I pose to you is such: while online are we socialising? I get a lot of grief from my parents who accuse me of being an antisocial bastard whenever I'm on the PC, and playing a game with forum members/browsing the forum/using MSN/Facebook/debating on 606 (BBC site)/etc. Basically any online activity, of which nearly all involve people who i know either in RL, or from places like this forum. What makes me annoyed is that people call these things antisocial, and yet I feel as though I am socialising with my peers, or people who share similar interests. Both are members of a community I am involved in, and socialising is interacting with your chosen community... While I realise and state right now that this is not a total replacement for face-to-face contact, it can replace it at times. Therefore, to paraphrase what somebody said to me earlier: "Sometimes I'd rather be playing L4D/Tf2 with you guys instead of being in a crappy bar with horribly awful music blaring out, and drunk people all over the place." It's a different form of socialising, but one I find equally as effective, in moderation.

So, do you reckon that it it is a bad thing to be socialising in this way? Are we socialising at all? And finally, as it piques my curiosity: what do your parents think (if relevant), and how if at all do you convince them that it is reasonably appropriate in this new clime?

Looking forward to your thoughts

[WNxMastrefubu]

IMO, thats a great point, we are communicateing there fore we are socializing

[Ghostrider]

I am currently on a voice chat with Fubu and Nem, and it's definitely "socializing". Socialization is defined as interaction with others, and whether we are typing, voice chatting, or talking face to face, we are socializing.

[Rayburn]

If chatting via PC cannot be considered socialising, they might as well say that writing letters isn't either. It doesn't matter which medium you use - you're always
getting in contact with other human beings, discussing subjects, playing games, sharing opinions etc. Those who pretend that this is 'anti-social' seem to be afraid
of the digitalisation of our society, nothing more. They condemn what they don't understand/what they don't want to learn to understand at their older age.

Edited by Rayburn, 28 May 2009 - 05:49.

[Chyros]

Though, so to speak, I wouldn't cancel a night with my friends for Left 4 Friday, I still think the online culture is, to some degree, socialising. Of a bunch of people here I know the name, where they live, how old they are, what they do, what they sound like, etc. - basically meeting them physically is the only thing that really separates me and them. And though they'll never be as good friends as my RL buddies, I can't say I haven't built some kind of relationship with them .

[ultimentra]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I consider it socializing as well.

[Dauth]

We are socialising, we're communicating, we've got our own sub culture of in jokes that mean very little to people outside this community.

As for the parents comments, I'm too old to be worried and I was smart enough to get the message "No news is good news" to my parents while young. I like to spend a couple of hours a week on skype with them but that's about it.

[Golan]

It's definitely socializing, can't argue against that. It's this way pretty much by definition.
However, socializing on the internet is not on par with socializing in RL and should not be considered a compensation IMO. While it's a nice thing to chat with other people from around the world and there are many that I'd claim friends who I'll probably never be able to meet in person, it doesn't even remotely replace meeting a person in reality.

[Rich19]

Golan, on 28 May 2009, 9:22, said:

It's definitely socializing, can't argue against that. It's this way pretty much by definition.
However, socializing on the internet is not on par with socializing in RL and should not be considered a compensation IMO. While it's a nice thing to chat with other people from around the world and there are many that I'd claim friends who I'll probably never be able to meet in person, it doesn't even remotely replace meeting a person in reality.

Quoted for truth. Chatting on the net is definitely socializing, but it's different to socializing in real life. I wouldn't want to spend 100% of my time socializing with people who live on the other side of the world. I've got nothing against the people here, it's just that I can't have face to face contact with you all.

[Zero]

Are you interacting with other people? If so, yes.

The thing is that parents are from an older generation, and as such they are less willing to accept it, much like a lot of older people were afraid of flying when planes first came out. The thing is, that most older people are relatively unwilling to accept change, while young people do it oh so nonchalantly, hell, we LOVE change for the most part. To people of older ages, socializing was going out with friends and hanging out, while staying at home was anti-social. This, however, because of the internet, has changed because now you can socialize and stay at home simultaneously.


Another example of this is video games. Are they social or anti-social? Well, the majority of video games are social experiences, most especially shooters and RTSs which almost ALL have some form of multiplayer mode. If you ask my parents, however, they would say that playing video games would make you anti-social because you're not physically interacting. These newer generations of people are shying away from older customs. Before, without counting telephones, you could NOT socialize without being able to physically see the person. Now, however, the internet, cellphones, and other such wonderful things that define these newer generations allow us to do so.

In my opinion it comes from the adult fear of change. People don't like change, at least adults don't because it is unknown, change is scary for them where as children care far too little and have no ideals or thoughts that will be harmed by it all too much. Anyway, adults are afraid of change, and it is a very human characteristic, and while it is MUCH less apparent in younger adults, older adults ranging from their 40s to their 80s are afraid of change.

I leave you with this example: my music teacher has a friend who is in his 80s/90s and he REFUSES to buy or even use a remote control, he will instead get up and change the tv manually. And why does he do this? Simply put, because they didn't have remote controls when he was growing up.

[SquigPie]

Well, In both 1984 and Brave New World we had an extremely social society.

But I won't call either of them the best possible.

So what I'm saying is:

Socialising is overrated

[Pav:3d]

SquigPie, on 29 May 2009, 15:24, said:

Well, In both 1984 and Brave New World we had an extremely social society.

But I won't call either of them the best possible.

So what I'm saying is:

Socialising is overrated

What? Socialising in 1984 was acting as normal as possible without the chance of getting your ass dragged off and killed. People didnt do anything they paticularly liked, they were just brainwashed into thinking they were doing something they liked. When Smith went and actual socialised with someone he wanted to social with and do stuff he actually wanted to do with them it didnt end too well for either of them...

In Brave New World it was false socialising because you were from birth put with people who had been brainwashed the same way as you were, you couldnt really dislike them since thats the way you were programmed. You couldnt socialise with anyone outside your "class" since they were either inferior to you or you were inferior to them. Plus the constant drug use kept you in constanly social mood.

Thats IIRC... its been a while since Ive read either.

So its in a way socialising but not not the way you would want to socialise in any "noraml" society.

Edited by Pav3d, 29 May 2009 - 15:46.

[Ion Cannon!]

Pav3d, on 29 May 2009, 16:45, said:

So its in a way socialising but not not the way you would want to socialise in any "noraml" society.

I see you've been infected with FAJL.

From my perspective I have no RL friends that are like me personality wise. Don't mean to blow my trumpet but i'm fairly unique for my age, that or I just live in the wrong place. With the net I know some people who are like me. Because of this. the socialising I do with my RL friends is very different to that online, because they are so different.

I enjoy both but in different ways, but due to the actual physical human contact I enjoy RL more. Alot of the conversations I have with people online I couldn't have with my RL friends, because they simply wouldn't care / be interested / understand it. I don't go out as much as I would like anymore, but thats due to situations beyond my control. I seem to be going off topic here - anyway I count both as socialising. With RL taking preference over internet.

Edited by Ion Cannon!, 29 May 2009 - 15:57.

[Sharpnessism]

If it's with people you know in real life, I'd say yes (MSN and playing video games). I'd also say yes if you know each other well enough over the Internet. I'd say no if it's with some random person on the Internet who you're talking to.

For example, I wouldn't consider playing Starcraft against some random online person socializing, as I don't know him/her, I can't say anything meaningful except "GLHF, From?" and have maybe some small talk. If I was playing against someone I've played with for a long time and I've talked to many a times about things unrelated to the game itself, then yes.

Also @Brave New World, the people never developed meaningful/deep relationships with one another, when you socialize in RL and online, you'll eventually develop some sort of relationship. In BNW, the interaction between each person was extremely shallow, not because of "too much" socializing, but because of what Paved said, the people were brainwashed from birth and kept under control with drugs. I'd say those are both flawed examples, Squig.

Edited by Sharpnessism, 29 May 2009 - 21:00.

[Futschki]

Well I think that anyway of communication is actually a socialization but well it differs IMO .. even if you talked for years on MSN ud still find talking face to face kinda different I mean if you dont have experience talking in real life ud still find it so difficult to interact with strangers for example ...

[CommanderJB]

AJ, on 28 May 2009, 15:06, said:

This is something I've been mulling over for a bit, and recently, having seen others mention the same thing, thought it might make for interesting discussion.

The question I pose to you is such: while online are we socialising? I get a lot of grief from my parents who accuse me of being an antisocial bastard whenever I'm on the PC, and playing a game with forum members/browsing the forum/using MSN/Facebook/debating on 606 (BBC site)/etc. Basically any online activity, of which nearly all involve people who i know either in RL, or from places like this forum. What makes me annoyed is that people call these things antisocial, and yet I feel as though I am socialising with my peers, or people who share similar interests. Both are members of a community I am involved in, and socialising is interacting with your chosen community... While I realise and state right now that this is not a total replacement for face-to-face contact, it can replace it at times. Therefore, to paraphrase what somebody said to me earlier: "Sometimes I'd rather be playing L4D/Tf2 with you guys instead of being in a crappy bar with horribly awful music blaring out, and drunk people all over the place." It's a different form of socialising, but one I find equally as effective, in moderation.

So, do you reckon that it it is a bad thing to be socialising in this way? Are we socialising at all? And finally, as it piques my curiosity: what do your parents think (if relevant), and how if at all do you convince them that it is reasonably appropriate in this new clime?

Looking forward to your thoughts

+1

I know that the decorum standards of my position mean that I can't say just that, but I'd sure as heck like to. While my parents are less anti-Internet than they used to be (I think they've pretty much given up on trying to get me off it TBH), they are still sceptical about the idea of 'that damn computer' being used for socialising. I'd be the first to stand up and say that IMing is a poor match for being out with friends and doing something fun, but the simple fact is that playing in the street just doesn't cut it in the modern world. Moreover, this forum and other contacts I've forged in the digital realm have taught me things about life I simply would have had little chance to appreciate otherwise; I've definitely improved my knowledge of how and when to present an argument through internet debates, for example.
Put directly as responses to the final part, no it's most definitely not a bad thing to be socialising this way (though, like absolutely everything in this world, it is detrimental when done to excess), yes it is socialising, and my parents' views have been covered above.

[BeefJeRKy]

CommanderJB +1ing? The horror!

Anyway, on topic, I must agree that using the internet can be a form of socializing. Especially because as I grew up I became less interested in playing games outside and more into discussion with people. More often than not I find better serious discussion online than with friends who would rather play football (I don't mind playing but I don't exactly find it to be the only thing to do) or who talk about the ridiculous political scene in Lebanon or sometimes just more useless Hollywood dribble. My parents however didn't have the internet while growing up so they would play outside all along growing up. That said, I couldn't live purely on internet socializing activities, so going out to a bar or a club with friends is a must for me too. So I would say socializing on the internet is on par with discussions but not more.

[Libains]

Scope, on 30 May 2009, 17:13, said:

CommanderJB +1ing? The horror!

I'm in so much shock I may end up comatose

That being said, I agree with a lot of what has been said so far, in that the internet is a form of socialising. Living on IM-type communication is a no-go, but it's a different form of socialising, and one that some of us are more in-tune to than others. On a normal night in (eg one not designated for going out), I'd often rather be online than in the common room upstairs, which is essentially a piss-up, loud music and ridiculous MTV channels. Conversation is stimulating, and often with University students, you fail to get that due to varying levels of inebriation.

[SquigPie]

+1 ftw lawl!


On a more un-lulzy fashion, I consider the internet to be a bit like religion

There's a few people who use it for something deeper, as a source of knowledge about the world. Something pointfull.

Frankly, the majority use it for pure lulz.

And the ones who doesn't understand it hate it, and see it as the cause of all evil.

Not trying to start a religious discussion here, just loling.

Edited by SquigPie, 30 May 2009 - 22:24.

[Cuppa]

You are socializing on the internet, but it depends on where you go. In some cases you will get people who are no fun to communicate with (trolls etc.) or you may find people who actually want to have meaningful conversations. But even when you factor in things like webcams and voicechat, communication isn't as deep or as rich as in real life.

You can use the internet for socialization, but it should not be your primary provider of human contact.

[WNxMastrefubu]

i most people find that there are many more good people than ttrolls online. and this isnt even encompassing people you know. like family who live far away. when i talk to my aunts and cousins in different countries i believe that i am "socializing" with them

[Nid]

Around here, it's hard to find people with similar interests, which is the same reason, I assume, the rest of you are all here too.
Its just another form of contact, and when i'm out with my friends, I have a laugh about the hours I spend on this thing with them, but I couldnt find myself trying to explain what it's like in places like this to them, so I just let them think I'm antisocial.