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So are you suggesting that Code become a "new age furry" just because some furries aren't like him?

If he is unprepared to accept the criticism given to the whole as a result of others that claim to share his views, then yes. And he should be glad he has the choice, because others aren't quite as lucky. That, or accept the criticism and/or attempt to straighten out those that damage his image. Being a part of a collective means you reap the benefits but also face the consequences; whether you're American, African American, Asian, Gay/Lesbian/Bi, we ALL face stereotypes, both positive and negative. Furries are no different.

If this is not understood, then I might ask that, instead of misconstruing my argument to make me appear evil, you ask for further clarification.

And I move to have this thread transferred to a more appropriate discussion forum.

-Rorschach
Edited by Rorschach, 09 January 2009 - 23:17.

By now it's become much more of a heavy-calibre discussion than just a question, so agreed, and moved to PhC.
Edited by Chyros, 09 January 2009 - 23:28.

You still have this idea that it's somehow my problem that people are making straw-man attacks against furries. People who criticise me for being a furry must do so for valid reasons (i.e. reasons that actually pertain to my participation in the furry fandom) otherwise it renders their entire argument invalid. I could in fact say 'yes, I completely agree with you, but now let's talk about me' and they would have nothing more to say.

If you want to be part of a group with an identity you do not have to accept that people will think you are deviant if you are not. I honestly don't see how anyone person from ANY group, be nationality, sexual preference or personal/social interest etc is exactly the same the world over.

Why should any furry EXPECT to be considered deviant unless they actually are? And if the majority of any particular group are "normal" for their chosen interest and they broke away how would they ever possibly manage to maintain a membership of that group that stays 100% normal? You can't walk away from a group everytime someone new comes along with the same interest but a different take on it. That would be ludicrous.

We could take this to the extreme and suggest that I should go about reclassifying myself as British X as I don't like the way that some people stereotype my nationality. But this isn't feasible and imo morally very wrong.

It is not your fault that people are ignorant. But it is your fault that you allow yourself to fall victim to their ignorance.

I find furries weird not because they all own fursuits or all do this or all do that. I find it odd that they choose to be referred to as furries when furries carry such a reputation. Because I view furries as a collective (as they undoubtedly are), I must go with the poll option 3 based on the idea that option two does not cover all furries. I have a problem with some of them, but that is not a present option. And I feel my reasoning for having a problem with some of them is justified.

EDIT:
"Why should any furry EXPECT to be considered deviant unless they actually are?" Because that's the way the public perceives them in most cases.
"You can't walk away from a group everytime someone new comes along with the same interest but a different take on it." You can, but as you said, it would be ludicrous. That's why there is a present element of elasticity in acceptance in a group. Like how a least-squares regression line might describe a scatter plot. But when that group embraces outliers, such as the "super furries", that group is setting itself up for disaster, no?


-Rorschach
Edited by Rorschach, 09 January 2009 - 23:59.

Actually, the poll was meant to indicate your interest towards being a furry yourself. Option 1 means 'I am a furry'. Option 2 means 'I am not a furry but have no issues with others choosing to be'. Option 3 is 'I want nothing to do with furries, the world would be a better place without them'.

But I fit in between two and three. And for that reason, it only makes sense that I go with three, as two does not cover the scope. Like how if there are 5 people that need to get somewhere and the car only seats 4, another car must be added to accommodate that last individual. Option two does not cover it, and option three goes beyond. But the options given force me to go beyond because I am not perfectly all right with every single furry. There are, and I'm sure you can agree, some rather... "out-there" types.

-Rorschach

Then you still misunderstand. The poll, I restate, asks what your view/relation is towards the concept of the furry fandom. I.e. 'what is your relationship to the furry fandom?' The poll mentions nothing about its members, hence it does not require you to make any assumptions about other furries, only about your stance towards the idea of furries itself. Option 3 indicates that you find the very idea of furries discusting at every level, while option 2 indicates that while you are not interested in being a furry, you have no problem with others choosing to be. Hence option 3 is the intolerance-driven 'exterminate' answer, while option 2 is the more neutral 'don't care' answer.

But you collectively group furries. I'm against the concept of furries as some describe them, I don't mind the concept as others describe them. When a definition is so ambiguous (thus why I stress a separation of groups being more appropriate), such a poll can not be accurate.

-Rorschach

I'm not sure I understand here. Would you refuse to be called an American because some (disclaimer: obviously wrong) people think America is evil and all its inhabitants are idiots? You can't just say 'this tag is regarded as bad by some, so let's make another arbitrary different tag and the problem will go away'.

I would disregard those opinions, declare their respective holders ignorant, and carry on.

-Rorschach

That's EXACTLY what furries generally do, and it's what I've been trying to do as well. So you just answered your own question, have a nice day. ^^

But then I just ask: Why? I have to take crap for being albino, being American, et cetera. I choose to take crap for being an erd, a modder, et cetera because they also provide benefits.

Are there any benefits to the furry fandom that would lead you to accept the negative stereotypes?

-Rorschach

Interaction with people who share your feelings?

But there is plenty of that elsewhere.

-Rorschach

I don't mind it. I like a girl with animal ears but not the whole costume cos i just think thats a bit much.

*googles*

Rorschach, on 10 Jan 2009, 10:35, said:

Rorschach i take shit from friends in xfire who live in america all the time about Australian stereotypes like how we use kangaroos instead of shopping trolleys and that we all wear akubra hats and dress and talk like steve irwin and paul hogan in crocodile dundee i don't bitch and complain about taking shit from them i rise above it and dish shit back XD
morel of the story is don't let negative stereotypes like being albino, being American bother you. you would have to be very weak minded to let it get to you and will tell you what i say to friends all the time is this harden the fuck up it could be worse

Not to sound rude but... did you at all comprehend the meaning of that post?

-Rorschach
Edited by Rorschach, 10 January 2009 - 05:19.

... Haaahahahahaha. :(

~V.

i try my best its not much fault i have a short attention span XD
and what if this became a religion lol then id get scared

Major Fuckup, on 10 Jan 2009, 11:27, said:

Not to come across as offensive but I think it's probably better if you try to avoid this part of the forum if you suffer short attention span, and think in such a way.

This opinion is also gathered from other posts you have made here in the PhC.

I don't care if someone is a furry, it just personally isn't my thing. In real life, I am a nerd, and proud of it to a certain extent. My social life suffers a bit for it, but there are many other perks to it, such as doing extremely well in school or anything associated with computers. Therefore, I enjoy being a nerd, and am typically open about it. However, there are those who take it to the next level, and those are the ones that give others within the group a bad name.

In any group, there will always be extremists. For example, the term nerd is used to describe the stereotypical 20-year-old who lives in his parents' basement watching Star Trek reruns and playing online mmorpg's for 18 hours straight, devouring bags upon bags of potato chips. However, it is also used to describe the ones who take it to a much lesser extent, taking an interest in computers, or just doing well in school.

The above example also describes the malleability of the definition of these social or internet groups. The term nerd can be used to describe a smart person who takes an interest in computers or his/her studies. Alternatively, it is used to describe the aforementioned Star Trek junkie. Likewise, the definition of furry ranges from those who like certain characters, to their respective extremists. Of course, mass media and those looking to bash or flame other rival groups will always be directed at the immensely stereotypical extremist version of the group, rather than those who are moderates in comparison, who typically make up most of the population of that group.

These things will 99% of the time be present in any social grouping, class, or likewise division between people. It is just something that people have to accept, as there is always someone who strongly disagrees with your opinion, or just doesn't like you, and will do anything to drop your reputation amongst others. Just go to school for a day, you will see it everywhere.

-Jordan

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I'm not.