64 replies to this topic

[ΓΛPTΘΓ]

I wanted to share my view on the way music being listened nowadays, mind you I am still a teenager and will still be one for many years to come and therefore I may not know the ways it is before I am born.

I think now music is thought as less of a main entertainment nowadays, it almost become like a ‘background’ for some people. Listening to music on a loud common room, in-car, when chatting to friends but not sitting down quietly and enjoy the music as a main form of entertainment. Overall, it’s like degrading music to just background sound. Also the way music is listened to brother me too, the dreaded white earbud with one dangling down the side, one in the ear and playing music though deafening volume certain does no good, and I doubt anyone can hear any detail of the music. But most of all its the hatchback driver with massive sub at the boot, while being heard miles away also the bass is turned up to turn every note in the music into low rumbles.

Let me include some real life experience from myself, not long ago I went to a dinner with a party afterwards for my swimming club. After dinner, the party began but not for me. The DJ hired have like 2 mid-range speakers and over 10 massive sub, when the ‘music’ start I couldn’t stand staying there. The volume is deafening even though I am wearing a closed-back monitoring headphones at the time, and the bass makes me feel really sick and feel like puking up my meal that I just ate. But everyone else seems fine, is it just me?

In older days, music is a real luxury and is only possible though a home system. Most sit enjoy music as the only entrainment, and never ever dreamt of the thought of music everywhere, anytime.

Music takes lots of patience and hardwork to make, but turning a wonderful tune with full range of sound into plain bass is quite simply unforgivable, it might be better to listen to explosions rather than music as it have more bass and volume.

Is music now underrated? Please have your view on this.

Edited by ΓΛPΤΘΓ, 01 June 2009 - 03:34.

[BeefJeRKy]

I remember reading an article like this on CNET. Indeed, these days people including me care less about the fine details in music, so we opt for portability instead. While I do prefer higher quality sound, I do find it quite expensive to get all the necessary equipment. You need a high quality record player, with a high quality vacuum tube amplifier along with expensive speakers that have the focus on tweeters and not subwoofers etc... While I hate the white earbuds packaged with iPods, I will never give up the portability of MP3 files to go back to CDs or worse Vinyl Records (best sound quality IMO). I am satisfied with mediocre quality of sound because my ears probably aren't sensitive enough anymore. Also regarding the background music, it is very true because I can multitask listening but not reading so I turn it on while doing any revision on my PC.

[TehKiller]

Well my father is quite the opposite of the youth these days...He listens to CDs and Vynils only and most of the time im always around when he turns it on (especially when he turns on the old record player...even if its ancient it still sounds awesome) so after hearing that quality of music I dislike the MP3/4's. Though the only way I would listen over one of them is if I had very large quality music on it (320+ kbps).

Anyway...today people just turn on the music for the feeling. The dudes in the car turn it on just because they want to feel the bass while driving, bars turn it on....well because people are drunk and will order more drinks if they hear louder and faster music (this is actually true...well atleast when it comes to turbofolk)

[Destiny]

Quote

But everyone else seems fine, is it just me?

Even though I occasionally make my Realtek HD Audio Manager make all sounds/music like in a concert hall or an auditorium with settings like rock and live etc., I always avoid bass. After hearing it for a bit of time there's this really...strange feeling that makes you wanna gtfo of there. You're not the only one I don't really like noisy places, that's why I don't know any bands out there 'cept for a couple my acquaintances tell me about. I never really explored there anyway. Never been to a real party, a concert or such before.

I do occasionally just sit back and listen to any music I have on my comp, at a softened volume. Techno, Rock and stuff really builds up that strange feeling if you've listened to it for long...and if the volume is high. Though I only have a headset for all of this.











...oh yea, the headset's made in China, too.

[Slightly Wonky Robob]

Taking this on a slight tangent here (although possibly one of the reason music has become a form of "background" entertainment)... two words; Mainstream music.

When I was young I never really listened to music, or at least I never taught CDs/Tapes, I just never saw the attraction. Embarrassingly enough I started buying (well parents buying for me) "Now" CDs, pop compilation CDs, eventually I moved on to Eminem and various other Hip Hop/ Rap artists, "Why?" I hear you cry... one simple reason, one of my best friends (who was/is older than me) was listening to that sort of Music. I didn't even understand half the stuff that was being said, or probably more not even really "listening" to the lyrics and considering that Hip Hop is a very lyrical heavy genre, it doesn't seem to be a good reason to listen to it. I then got into different types of rock, pretty much for the same reason, because my friends were listening to that sort of music (and also because rock was used quite a bit on BMX and skate videos, which I used to watch). Finally about 3 or 4 years ago I started listening to BBC Radio 1 on the internet, I started off with Scott Mills, and some of the other "funny" DJs, but because I was listening live I used to end up listening to some of the specialist DJs in the evening, anyway long story short I started getting into Dance music, why? For once, for the right reason, because I actually liked the music.

To sum up, most people nowadays simply listen to music because there friends listen to that type of music, or because it's "cool" to do so. It's usually pop music or rock music. Now don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with the rock genre, I can still enjoy and appreciate rock, but it's just not my preferred genre. When I was at school, everyone wanted to be in a rock band, and a large portion of people were, were they any good? Nope, so why did they do it? You guessed it, because it's cool and everyone was doing it.

Which brings me back to the original topic, part of the reason music has moved to the background, and no-one is appreciating music any more (at least IMO) is because most people aren't listening to music they actually like..

Another part of the reason maybe because of a much busier lifestyle, ask someone how they are, and a common response is "tired". So this maybe a reason music has been moved to a secondary or background form of entertainment. I always have music on in the background while I am working, if I dedicated a time in the day purely to listening to music, I probably wouldn't get much work done

[Golan]

While I enjoy listening to music very much, only rarely do I do so without distraction. The main reason is that while listening to music is very relaxing and enjoyable to me, staying either focused solely on the music or completely relaxed for more than about 20 minutes has become increasingly difficult for me (mainly due to stress from university).
What I prefer is listening to music while being occupied with "meaningless" activities - everything that keeps me busy enough not to have the energy to let my mind wander, but at the same time isn't substantial enough to overshadow the actual music. This usually is doing maths (yeah, seriously) and sports (bicycling mainly) for me.

While I know that many people find it important to have proper music equipment, I'm fine with having a (good) Mp3 player. Sure there is a difference in quality, but once said quality is on an acceptable level, for me it is more important to have appealing melody/lyrics. IMO music should be heard with ones mind, not ears.

Now, on the issue of subwoofers - I find smaller ones to be a worthwhile addition to one's equipment as it simply is an important part to some music styles. Overdone bass sounds are a no-go for me though, simply because I had them hijack my heart rate on several occasions (though it only works in a specific BpM range). It's NOT fun when, after two hours of cycling, some dipshit pulls around the corner with his car and drops your heart rate down to two-thirds of what it'd need to be. Not that it'd happen much, but it sort of leaves you biased...

[General]

I've experienced far worse things and sadly still do ! People open their most favourite track to listen on media player and as its adjustment set to ' repeat ', it plays for a few good hours sometimes, until I wake up and say ' Wtf is going on, is it a dream or wtf is this shit ? ! ', then people get wake up aswell and turn off the fuking music !

People just don't listen it ' consciously ', its not meant to be for background, unless you are playing game or watching movie which their music prepared especially for specific scenes, if you tend to listen it when you browsing web or doing your ' job ', then it will fuck up your brain.

Also I have a problem with people screaming when listening the trance music, yes they are mainly meant to be made for dance and party things but I just can't take it when people screaming over there, I want to listen music, not your repulsive screaming, thats why I never go to a club even though I like trance music, headphones does the job well and ' peacefully '. I also just can't respect the music I dislike, I know it is not right but I never get used to listen something which I do not like

Edited by General, 01 June 2009 - 21:17.

[NOPE]

Lilith agrees with you that music isn't treated with the respect it used to gain. She tries to avoid multitasking when she listens to music - often, she finds herself lying on the floor beside her phonograph, listening to, say, a concerto by Rachmaninov or Beethoven. She will confess that when listening to music, she tends to imagine herself seeing the artist perform live. ^^
However, she is inclined to argue that it is not the listener's fault that music is so abused in the modern day world: music artists themselves are to blame above all. Musicians put less effort into their music nowadays. Music used to be REAL - in earlier centuries, there weren't programs to auto-tune your music if you played or sang a note wrong. Apart from that, before recording devices were created, music was always enjoyed live, so you could appreciate it with all of your senses, instead of just HEARING it. Though it seems more convenient to be able to listen to music whenever you like, recorded music is so lacking in that not only does it omit the humanity of "real" music, which contains missed notes, incorrect tuning [which makes every live performance unique], and general imperfections, but recorded music omits the visual part of music.
If this post seems incoherent, Lilith apologizes, as she is currently experiencing a migraine that her top-quality medicine somehow failed to cure.

Edited by Lil, 06 July 2009 - 02:38.

[Sgt. Nuker]

Music, or as the term is loosely applied to the mass-produced filth from the "record companies" (actually, it's more like 1 or 2 in the US that controls most, if not ALL the music put out for the main stream), has literally taken a back seat. If you see a car on the street with a body kit, flashy rims and a fart cannon sticking sideways under the boot, the "music" that's being played really has taken a back seat (the sub woofers are a dead give away and the back of the car is where they reside). You go to a party, or a pub, or a bowling alley, what do you hear above the din of people chatting? Music. In today's society, music gives an establishment or a party an atmosphere or sets the mood. It seems that a vast majority don't care for the lyrics of a song (this would explain purely "instrumental" songs or how songs bred by today's popular culture get away with crude and crass euphemisms).

Myself, I enjoy a wide array of styles from the simple to the complex and everything in between, though to an extent, I prefer the complex songs, with lyrics that demand a second or third thought. Songs that include more than just a guitar, bass and drums are also among the ones I seek, because it shows that the artist has a taste for what music really is.

[WNxMastrefubu]

bah, imo people are much too harsh on mainstream music, the songs are good and fun to listen too near all the time. thats y their main stream, their widely accepted because they are good. their artists worked hard on their songs and for it to be ruled out as filth just because most people like it is wrong

[Pav:3d]

Quote

their artists worked hard on their songs

Not. really.

The "artists" pump out some garbage (which is written by somebody else) and then an entire studio edits everything so it sounds perfect. Its not music, its just a brand to sell.

There is a great vid somewhere which explains all this, If I find it ill post it...

Edited by Pav3d, 06 July 2009 - 08:51.

[Alias]

Warboss Nooka, on 6 Jul 2009, 14:36, said:

It seems that a vast majority don't care for the lyrics of a song (this would explain purely "instrumental" songs or how songs bred by today's popular culture get away with crude and crass euphemisms).

To be quite honest that is rubbish. As a person whose music collection is at least 75% instrumental I can tell you instrumental music can easily carry with it as much meaning as music with lyrics does. While it is not verbal meaning, a lot of instrumental music provides a huge amount of aural-visual meaning that is easily equal to any verbal meaning.

Warboss Nooka, on 6 Jul 2009, 14:36, said:

Myself, I enjoy a wide array of styles from the simple to the complex and everything in between, though to an extent, I prefer the complex songs, with lyrics that demand a second or third thought. Songs that include more than just a guitar, bass and drums are also among the ones I seek, because it shows that the artist has a taste for what music really is.

The simple guitar, bass and drums can provide quite a 'complex' sound by themselves, even without the need of any vocals or extra instruments - yes it may be simple in nature but it still can be very deep. You don't need more than just a simple guitar to make music, I can name to you several awesome acoustic guitar players who have a greater 'taste' in music than an entire band.

[BeefJeRKy]

I must agree with Alias on his last point. I do not think lyrics define music. Just listen to a classical symphony and you'll realize lyrics are a secondary aspect of music.

[Nid]

Its as simple as bieng put down to the way we live.
The human race has evolved with the use of our sense of vision as somewhat more important than anything else.
We don't want to just hear things, we want to see things.
While I know that I and practically everyone would not give up their sense of hearing for anything in the world (bieng deaf in one ear for a few days put that into perspective for me), but it just seems to be a simple fact that people prefer visual entertainment over a form of entertainment based around sounds, so as soon as Television and Personal Computers were introduced, people swiftly moved on from their Dansettes and record players to their means of visual entertainment.

[Golan]

While I agree that many singers these days simply cannot sing* (a local radio station often plays live recordings of mainstream bands - seriously, most of this is so HORRIBLE that it hurts) this shouldn't mean that their music (the edited one without any ear-scream potential) is bad or have people call it filth. The music in its release version might not be natural, but isn't that part of music? Just as we use instruments to further the possibilities of music, just as many great artists use synthetic effects to improve their already impressive music, isn't the use of editing utilities just as well a means to make proper music? IMO music should be judged by how it presents itself in the end, not how it was made.

So you feel that lack of proper lyrics is a downside? Fucking don't touch my Beethoven collection!


*Disclaimer: Being aware of the fact that I argued against calling a type of music generally bad/filthy/horrible/etc., this is meant as a comparing statement of what they want to sing and the inhuman torment that actually results from it.

[BeefJeRKy]

Also, I may not consider stuff by Lil Wayne or Soulja Boy to be music, but I can find them entertaining to listen to occasionally

[NOPE]

I'm a little sad that nobody commented on my previous post.

Warboss Nooka, on 6 Jul 2009, 5:36, said:

It seems that a vast majority don't care for the lyrics of a song (this would explain purely "instrumental" songs or how songs bred by today's popular culture get away with crude and crass euphemisms).

Myself, I enjoy a wide array of styles from the simple to the complex and everything in between, though to an extent, I prefer the complex songs, with lyrics that demand a second or third thought. Songs that include more than just a guitar, bass and drums are also among the ones I seek, because it shows that the artist has a taste for what music really is.

I find your opinions on what music really is to be frankly rather appalling.
As someone previously touched on, classical music rarely puts emphasis on lyrics, and if you were to listen to electronic music such as trance, you would know that they often don't either.
If you think that an arrangement of "only" three instrument is too simplistic for your taste, then I can't help but wonder if you've never picked up an instrument and attempt to learn it, as playing or listening to a solo piece is just as satisfying as a band or orchestra may be. The quality of music doesn't depend on the instruments used: it depends on the actual context of the music.
Regardless, I'll move on.

WNxMastrefubu, on 6 Jul 2009, 7:33, said:

bah, imo people are much too harsh on mainstream music, the songs are good and fun to listen too near all the time. thats y their main stream, their widely accepted because they are good. their artists worked hard on their songs and for it to be ruled out as filth just because most people like it is wrong

Clearly you aren't familiar with what goes on in studios. Many artists use programs like auto-tune [I touched on this in my last post: I suggest you go read that so I don't have to repeat my spiel on why natural music is better].
I'd also like to point out that music is not "Mainstream" because it's good. It's "mainstream" because the artists have signed certain contracts to have their music publicized.

Golan, on 6 Jul 2009, 10:27, said:

Just as we use instruments to further the possibilities of music, just as many great artists use synthetic effects to improve their already impressive music, isn't the use of editing utilities just as well a means to make proper music? IMO music should be judged by how it presents itself in the end, not how it was made.

So you feel that lack of proper lyrics is a downside? Fucking don't touch my Beethoven collection!

Autotune is not always a bad thing, as it can be used to achieve a certain artificial effect that some artists intend to incorporate into their works [take Daft Punk for instance]. However, as I have said before, pitch correction ruins the uniqueness of a piece, as it tunes any notes played or sung to 12 frequencies that are considered the "official" notes.

Edited by Lil, 06 July 2009 - 14:39.

[Sgt. Nuker]

Alias, on 6 Jul 2009, 5:01, said:

To be quite honest that is rubbish. As a person whose music collection is at least 75% instrumental I can tell you instrumental music can easily carry with it as much meaning as music with lyrics does. While it is not verbal meaning, a lot of instrumental music provides a huge amount of aural-visual meaning that is easily equal to any verbal meaning.

And by "instrumental" I guess I should have been more clear. Pardon me for considering this genre "music", but we all know a lot of Techno doesn't take much to create. Most of the basic beat is rehashed, reused, recycled, ad inf.

I am fully aware of instrumentals that are created by an actual band, are in fact, quite complex and actually can be considered music. They are aurally pleasing and have no need for lyrics, for in many, if not all cases, lyrics might actually ruin them.

[Alias]

Warboss Nooka, on 6 Jul 2009, 23:35, said:

And by "instrumental" I guess I should have been more clear. Pardon me for considering this genre "music", but we all know a lot of Techno doesn't take much to create. Most of the basic beat is rehashed, reused, recycled, ad inf.

Been more clear? You can't really be more clear then 'instrumental', its a pretty broad word to just pull out of nowhere. It shouldn't matter how long the artists take on it, or how much effort it takes to produce.
What matters is how much heart they put into it when making and performing it.

Warboss Nooka, on 6 Jul 2009, 23:35, said:

I am fully aware of instrumentals that are created by an actual band, are in fact, quite complex and actually can be considered music. They are aurally pleasing and have no need for lyrics, for in many, if not all cases, lyrics might actually ruin them.

Why does it have to be made by a band? A single person can do just as good a job as four.

[Libains]

Alias, on 6 Jul 2009, 17:12, said:

Warboss Nooka, on 6 Jul 2009, 23:35, said:

And by "instrumental" I guess I should have been more clear. Pardon me for considering this genre "music", but we all know a lot of Techno doesn't take much to create. Most of the basic beat is rehashed, reused, recycled, ad inf.

Been more clear? You can't really be more clear then 'instrumental', its a pretty broad word to just pull out of nowhere. It shouldn't matter how long the artists take on it, or how much effort it takes to produce.
What matters is how much heart they put into it when making and performing it.

Tbh, I feel Nooka was in fact referring to instrumental stuff similar to Mint Royale's version of Singing in the Rain

Completely re-used, this probably took a person one afternoon in a recording studio with a few electronic gadgets, which is not what the music industry should ever have been about. It reached number one in the UK, and frankly, never deserved it. It has no sense of cohesion, no sense of 'heart', and winds me the hell up because it is completely recycled nonsense, with not a single lyric, beside recorded versions from the old song. And what is even worse, is that while we think of this as an instrumental piece - I would bet that there was not a single recording from an instrument done for this song. The music industry has gone the wrong way imo, and almost half the songs I hear nowadays recycle the beat, the tune, the lyrics or the whole damn song from another song. It's not on for me, especially when thrown in with a pile of techno-rubbish.

Edited by AJ, 06 July 2009 - 16:39.

[TheDR]

[quote name='AJ' post='665695' date='6 Jul 2009, 17:37'][quote name='Alias' post='665686' date='6 Jul 2009, 17:12'][quote name='Warboss Nooka' post='665625' date='6 Jul 2009, 23:35']And by "instrumental" I guess I should have been more clear. Pardon me for considering this genre "music", but we all know a lot of Techno doesn't take much to create. Most of the basic beat is rehashed, reused, recycled, ad inf.[/quote]Been more clear? You can't really be more clear then 'instrumental', its a pretty broad word to just pull out of nowhere. It shouldn't matter how long the artists take on it, or how much effort it takes to produce.
What matters is how much heart they put into it when making and performing it.
[/quote]
Tbh, I feel Nooka was in fact referring to instrumental stuff similar to Mint Royale's version of Singing in the Rain

Completely re-used, this probably took a person one afternoon in a recording studio with a few electronic gadgets, which is not what the music industry should ever have been about. It reached number one in the UK, and frankly, never deserved it. It has no sense of cohesion, no sense of 'heart', and winds me the hell up because it is completely recycled nonsense, with not a single lyric, beside recorded versions from the old song. And what is even worse, is that while we think of this as an instrumental piece - I would bet that there was not a single recording from an instrument done for this song. The music industry has gone the wrong way imo, and almost half the songs I hear nowadays recycle the beat, the tune, the lyrics or the whole damn song from another song. It's not on for me, especially when thrown in with a pile of techno-rubbish.
[/quote]
Just because a song is recycled doesn't mean its bad. Good music doesn't need to be original, its all opinion based on what you feel sounds best and shouldn't be classed as bad because its recycling older songs. Even when remixing or editing songs you still need to be a decent musician, its rather insulting when people class everything that has been made using a synthesizer as rubbish techno, when its normally very complicated and extensive pieces of music. I would like to see anyone produce something like the Mint Royale remix in one afternoon, it probably took them months of work, its such a shame that this kind of Electronic music is viewed in this way.

[Sgt. Nuker]

Alias, on 6 Jul 2009, 12:12, said:

Been more clear? You can't really be more clear then 'instrumental', its a pretty broad word to just pull out of nowhere. It shouldn't matter how long the artists take on it, or how much effort it takes to produce.
What matters is how much heart they put into it when making and performing it.

Oh, I don't know. Someone says instrumental, they could be talking about any style of instrumental. What genre? What instrument(s)? Who's performing it? I guess none of that matters because only instruments are involved. How much heart the artist puts into making a song or an album is effort. How much heart and work any band or person puts into a performance IS effort. You can tell when an artist has put their heart into something. Therefore they've put forth the effort to make sure you, the listener/consumer, know it's there.

Alias, on 6 Jul 2009, 23:35, said:

Why does it have to be made by a band? A single person can do just as good a job as four.

Really? You went there? Really? Alright, because I guess when you read this far into what someone says and all you're out to do is pick that person apart, all you see is the literal meaning of what they typed. Okay, cool. Do you not think I realize that a single person can create "instrumental" music? There was a band called Joy Electric, and it used to be 3 guys. The band made electronic music (some would call it noise). Now Joy Electric is one guy. That's it, one guy. Because of the name, people still call it a "band", even though, technically, he's not the typical definition.

Edited by Warboss Nooka, 06 July 2009 - 18:05.

[Ion Cannon!]

[quote name='AJ' post='665695' date='6 Jul 2009, 17:37'][quote name='Alias' post='665686' date='6 Jul 2009, 17:12'][quote name='Warboss Nooka' post='665625' date='6 Jul 2009, 23:35']And by "instrumental" I guess I should have been more clear. Pardon me for considering this genre "music", but we all know a lot of Techno doesn't take much to create. Most of the basic beat is rehashed, reused, recycled, ad inf.[/quote]Been more clear? You can't really be more clear then 'instrumental', its a pretty broad word to just pull out of nowhere. It shouldn't matter how long the artists take on it, or how much effort it takes to produce.
What matters is how much heart they put into it when making and performing it.
[/quote]
Tbh, I feel Nooka was in fact referring to instrumental stuff similar to Mint Royale's version of Singing in the Rain

Completely re-used, this probably took a person one afternoon in a recording studio with a few electronic gadgets, which is not what the music industry should ever have been about. It reached number one in the UK, and frankly, never deserved it. It has no sense of cohesion, no sense of 'heart', and winds me the hell up because it is completely recycled nonsense, with not a single lyric, beside recorded versions from the old song. And what is even worse, is that while we think of this as an instrumental piece - I would bet that there was not a single recording from an instrument done for this song. The music industry has gone the wrong way imo, and almost half the songs I hear nowadays recycle the beat, the tune, the lyrics or the whole damn song from another song. It's not on for me, especially when thrown in with a pile of techno-rubbish.
[/quote]

I would have said thats actually one of the better mainstream remix things. No, the worst are those " DANCE NATION 09 " They take a crap song, stick the same crap beat behind them all. And literally its just one fucking beat, or they speed it up and call it something else. Whatever it is, it isn't music. Its fucking trash.

The problem here is music is so much due to opinion. My opinion is 99% of mainstream music is rubbish. Most pop singers can't sing, which defeats the purpose of being a singer. Rap + Dance (As described above) shouldn't classify as music. And that rock / metal and the odd classical piece are the only things worth listening to. Now i'm aware someone is about to hotly contest this but i'm sure some will also agree. There really is no point though. Its my opinion your not going to change it.

Now onto the original topic.

I listen to music to experience emotion, to sing along to it (If it has lyrics). That is IMO musics purpose, to produce emotion. This emotion can be produced by the lyrics, the tone of the lyrics, the instruments, the volume, the pitch, literally anything can elicit emotion - even if your not sure what the emotion actually is.

The problem is as previously stated its just become a background thing. Take for example my sixth form common room. There is always "4 Music" or "The Hits" on. Why is that? Nobody is actually listening to it. I turned it off a few times and nobody cared, so why is it on? I much prefer talking to people with no background noise. This is one of the reasons I don't like clubbing much. You have to shout at the top of your voice, and even then its possible they won't hear it. We've created a place were people go to socialise, with no communication involved? Somethings seriously wrong there.

[Golan]

I really can't see how you come to declare whole types of music as "non-music" just because you don't like em. Especially seeing how you use the different terms in an extremely broad meaning and simply apply your dislike for a couple of songs (really, what's 20 to several ten thousands on the whole?) to a whole genre.

[Ion Cannon!]

This isn't what the topics about. By discussing my opinion I was trying to show how futile and pointless it is. Notice how every topic on music ends up with people arguing about whats best and so on?