42 replies to this topic

[Prophet of the Pimps]

to be honest i dont see anything wrong with this. the price is decent and internet in iran is shit so people there cant download most of the big size mods. as long as he isnt change the content on the mod and the credit file isnt changed he isnt doing anything bad.

[Kris]

Prophet of the Pimps, on 8 Feb 2010, 0:19, said:

to be honest i dont see anything wrong with this. the price is decent and internet in iran is shit so people there cant download most of the big size mods. as long as he isn't change the content on the mod and the credit file isn't changed he isnt doing anything bad.

Now that you mentioned the Shit internet in iran; I think this is also the reason why i saw a CD of Reborn v4.0 to v6.0  and a few other mods here in the philippines . Heck, even the torrents you can download for free can be bought as a DVD/CD here .  

I think the dude is just selling a DVD package in order to save your ass from wasting hours downloading it. In short, by "buying" a hard copy; you just saved your ass from burning precious time and as a return, you paid his internet and DVD/CD.


But still though, he did it without any permission from the mod authors.

[Mbob61]

So selling someone else's work which he has no rights to is ok?

Mike

[Golan]

Shouldn't you be discussing the moral and ethical complications of this issue somewhere else? Point is a) you can't keep him from doing it other than asking him nicely, so if you want him to do so then ask him nicely and be done with, and b) the legal situation in his country means that he's probably indeed not doing anything illegal.

[Prophet of the Pimps]

Mbob61, on 7 Feb 2010, 22:19, said:

So selling someone else's work which he has no rights to is ok?

Mike

By releasing Mod we are giving explicit authorisation to Redistribute it in any medium possible. As long as he doesn't change the content and take out the credit file its ok in my books. Hell if the logistics of it was possible we could sell boxed edition for a nominal price so as to not constitute Profit. How is this guy selling it on DVD any different a mod being hosted on some website. Most website never ask for explicit permission. If that was required you guys would technically be barred from giving your friends a copy of the mod. Also again. This is Iran, Its a task to download anything over the shitty internet they have and lets not even talk about censorship. In short, this guy is providing a service and he is charging for that service. Burning a DVD and Posting it is time consuming process and no one is gonna do it for free.

[Libains]

Prophet of the Pimps, on 8 Feb 2010, 20:35, said:

Mbob61, on 7 Feb 2010, 22:19, said:

So selling someone else's work which he has no rights to is ok?

Mike

By releasing Mod we are giving explicit authorisation to Redistribute it in any medium possible. As long as he doesn't change the content and take out the credit file its ok in my books. Hell if the logistics of it was possible we could sell boxed edition for a nominal price so as to not constitute Profit. How is this guy selling it on DVD any different a mod being hosted on some website. Most website never ask for explicit permission. If that was required you guys would technically be barred from giving your friends a copy of the mod. Also again. This is Iran, Its a task to download anything over the shitty internet they have and lets not even talk about censorship. In short, this guy is providing a service and he is charging for that service. Burning a DVD and Posting it is time consuming process and no one is gonna do it for free.

Yea... no.

By releasing a mod you are far from allowing people to redistribute it as they see fit. If you distribute intellectual property the basic legal grounding for that is that it can only be distributed through the means in which you distributed it yourself, which in this manner is digital distribution without any physical means - thus a website can happily mirror the download, but it cannot give away a hard copy. If you include in the readme file, or as a seperate file altogether, that the files may be redistributed at will in an unchanged form, then yes, he can do whatever he damn well pleases. I don't know intellectual property laws from wherever this guys is selling these from, but he has absolutely no right, or legal grounds, through which to distribute these mods without explicit permission from their creators as far as UK law is concerned - even without a patent, something that is created entirely by one person, or a group of people, is their intellectual property - redistribution is theft, whether for profit, or not. The law doesn't take into account whethere you make money on something - imagine you are selling pirated DVDs - you download a copy from the internet (practically no cost), and then start buying DVDs for £1 each, burning them, and selling them for £1 each (not even taking into account time for labour). Therefore, you're making absolutely no money from it in - if you apply this to the theory you've just outlined above that is a legal concept, but it is blatantly not. Intellectual property laws are far more broad ranging than right and wrong, and just because you don't profit, doesn't mean it's not illegal.

As far as I can see however, there will be no means in which to stop this bloke from providing these DVDs to people, I would bet my life nobody here speaks Farsi and even if they did it would make no difference due to the readily availableness that is modifications, so you may as well all see it as a means of getting your mods out to more people.

Also, looking into it further, Iran actually has a LOT of anti-piracy and intellectal property laws, considering they're a member of the World Intellectual Property Organization. However, due to the United States being... well the United States... Iran refuses to acknowledge the WTO copyright laws and as a result of it, software and other forms of digital intellectual property, whethere copyrighted or not, are freely reproducible in the country as the copyright just doesn't apply.

[Nid]

TBH, anyone that buys off him is a sucker because you can download these mods for free.
While he is redistributing your mods without permission, what actual effect does it have on you, the creators? You distribute them for free yourselves anyway, you lose nothing from him selling them on a DVD for what looks like pennies anyway. If he was crediting himself to these mods, or was distributing mods that were actually sold by the initial distributor, (which AFAIK is impossible for a mod anyway) then there would be problems.

[Prophet of the Pimps]

Nidmeister, on 9 Feb 2010, 4:06, said:

TBH, anyone that buys off him is a sucker because you can download these mods for free.
While he is redistributing your mods without permission, what actual effect does it have on you, the creators? You distribute them for free yourselves anyway, you lose nothing from him selling them on a DVD for what looks like pennies anyway. If he was crediting himself to these mods, or was distributing mods that were actually sold by the initial distributor, (which AFAIK is impossible for a mod anyway) then there would be problems.

Do you know how shitty the internet connections in Iran are? I have Iranian friends so i get info from them personally. the best they can mange to get is 128 kbps connection and they don't even dare visit websites of some of the mod. Try downloading the Middle East Conflict Mod and see how fast the secret police hits up your ass. For them they are getting an awesome deal from the DVD.

And the second point is precisely why i dont find this offensive. there is no monitory benefit for the modders. If the credit file is maintained then we should be happy that the mod is reaching to a larger audience.

Also better translation
http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y...sl=fa&tl=en

Edit: The guy also gives link to the download page so the DVD is not the only way to get it. Its a service for people who cant download and is charging a fair price. Same way how people can sell Linux distro CD's for people who cant download.
http://war-armageddo...log.com/post/15
See the Big download button at the end of the post.

Edit: Also on another note how many of you have carried installers of Freeware software around on cds or flash drives to give to your friends. in case anyone bother to read the EULA, it is a violation to of end user agreement for redistribution without explicit permission

Edited by Prophet of the Pimps, 09 February 2010 - 05:25.

[Destiny]

Quote

Try downloading the Middle East Conflict Mod and see how fast the secret police hits up your ass.

Wha...? Woah, what?

[CJ]

Destiny, on 9 Feb 2010, 6:41, said:

Quote

Try downloading the Middle East Conflict Mod and see how fast the secret police hits up your ass.

Wha...? Woah, what?

Censorship.
MEC shows a very bad face of the Arab countries by presenting them as terrorists and therefore it could be banned from Iran...

Quote

TBH, anyone that buys off him is a sucker because you can download these mods for free.

Nah, I had a shitty 256 connexion for a while, and I don't remeber all the times when I got mad at the downloads being corrupted when I finished them, especially with Cold War Crisis as it took me 23 frickin hours to get it and then it didn't work...
I can assure you that if I could get someone to do the download for me instead of spending so much time downloading, I'd have gladly bought that kind of DVD.

IMO you guys are just overreacting...

[Kris]

After reading how seriously bad the internet in Iran really is, i think i'm going to let him go. Why? He's just doing the iranian gamers a big favour and giving my mod a recognition in iran as a return .

Quote

Nah, I had a shitty 256 connexion for a while, and I don't remeber all the times when I got mad at the downloads being corrupted when I finished them, especially with Cold War Crisis as it took me 23 frickin hours to get it and then it didn't work...
I can assure you that if I could get someone to do the download for me instead of spending so much time downloading, I'd have gladly bought that kind of DVD.

Oh, don't remind me of my early days; I literately have to wait for hours or days just to finish downloading or uploading a mod back then....then finding out my internet disconnected because someone called on the phone ..

56kbps modem speed FTL.

Just like you, that DVD would literately save my ass instead of waiting for ages to finish a mod download.

Edited by Kris, 09 February 2010 - 10:23.

[Gen.Kenobi]

And he's helping you to expand your mods around the world

Edited by Gen.Kenobi, 12 February 2010 - 21:14.

[TehKiller]

Alright not sure if i got all the bits but from what i understood in the google translation (OP next time translate with the proper language...) he is hosting an mod hub in Iranian...basically all he does is give links and screenshots to DL the mods, gives reviews on em, made instructions on how to instal the mods (and how to actually edit the whole game) and heck even provided a link to DL the entire game.

Basically as far as i see theres nothing wrong with this (unless im wrong)

Argetlam, on 9 Feb 2010, 10:48, said:

Censorship.
MEC shows a very bad face of the Arab countries by presenting them as terrorists and therefore it could be banned from Iran...

No. Theres no reason for censorship as Iran is not an Arab country

[BeefJeRKy]

Yeah but Iran is still heavily represented in Middle East Conflict.

[CJ]

TehKiller, on 16 Feb 2010, 17:31, said:

Alright not sure if i got all the bits but from what i understood in the google translation (OP next time translate with the proper language...) he is hosting an mod hub in Iranian...basically all he does is give links and screenshots to DL the mods, gives reviews on em, made instructions on how to instal the mods (and how to actually edit the whole game) and heck even provided a link to DL the entire game.

Basically as far as i see theres nothing wrong with this (unless im wrong)

Argetlam, on 9 Feb 2010, 10:48, said:

Censorship.
MEC shows a very bad face of the Arab countries by presenting them as terrorists and therefore it could be banned from Iran...

No. Theres no reason for censorship as Iran is not an Arab country

JRK, on 16 Feb 2010, 19:50, said:

Yeah but Iran is still heavily represented in Middle East Conflict.

^That

Also, he's selling DVD, you clearly haven't used a good translator, or you didn't read everything, because there is a page with a big red 5000 on it and that's the price for the DVD (~3€)

[Failure]

Those kind of people are annoying.

Thank God, I'm keeping my mods to me and my well trusted friends who are not hosting it anywhere.
It would be nice to take down his site or atleast hack it.

[TehKiller]

Well still this dude aint doing this for profit but rather promotion of the mods (seriously if he was trying to really sell these mods for personal gain why in earth would he post links where you can dl the mods for free)

[Failure]

Well since none of us can read Arabic or what ever it's typed in, we cannot really tell what the hell he's doing.
Maybe he's a good guy and puts those mods on a disc because he thinks of people that don't have internet or something.
Or he's smart enough and tries to get cash from selling this.