55 replies to this topic

[Rayburn]

thinker, on 12 Jun 2007, 04:17, said:

Are you kidding me imagrants and people are what make a country so respect them. If a country only has one type of people it would suck. A country shouldnt do that to other religions. If you take away there biuldings there still gunna do the same thing somwhere else and the media will make your country look like its picking on muslims who are already racially attacked in other countrys. Doing that could cause a rebilion within that religion and would make your country look bad in the media to. So why do that its pointless there still going to figure out another way to do it. Correct\scorn me if im wrong.

I didn't say all immigrants suck nor did I say send them all to hell. Multiculturalism - if it's done properly - isn't necessarily bad. The problem is that it oftens fails because some immigrants don't integrate. They rather form their own communities instead of searching the dialogue with their hosting country. They rather stick to their own language instead of atleast learning the language of whatever new country they live it. This kind of immigration is one sided and doesn't enrich society at all. What will be next? Will I have to learn Turkish at school because the Turkish immigrants here refuse to learn German? Will I be forbidden to fly a German flag in Germany if some immigrant feels offended by the flag of a democratic state? A non-German friend of mine experienced the very same thing.
I don't want them to throw away what makes them unique but they should atleast accept what makes us unique and become a proper part of the society instead of building up their own in a different country. All I want them to is live by our rules and support our society because if we go to their country, they'll expect the very same thing from us.

Edited by Rayburn, 13 June 2007 - 08:47.

[Thinker]

We do intergrate like you said you shouldnt take away what makes us unique witch is religion and our language. All the muslims are trying to do is keep there religion alive and well. But instead are treated like dogs and told to go do it where some one cant see. Sure people will intergrate to a point but if we have to intergrate to the point where I dont know who I am anymore then no I will not. We intergrate to your schooling society and religion. Why no just at least let us do our religion. We work pay taxes and everything else a citizen is supoost to do so treat us like one and not just some imagrant. Also I didnt say you said they suck and we are most the time told to learn diffrent languages not becuase immagrants but education purposes. Even if you taught everyone your language in your counrty and told them to only speak that and so did everyone other country how would we communicate with each other There would be no one in a country who knew two languages becuase all others would be obselete in that country since the people who already lived there only spoke there language and made us learn it, what would be the point of speaking another language or keeping it alive in another country and therfore all other languages would die out in time in a country and they would only speak there orginal language. Tourism would end and communication between countries would to think about it.

Edited by Thinker, 13 June 2007 - 16:15.

[Whitey]

I'm perfectly fine with multiple religions and alanguages, I'm not perfectly fine with having them forced upon me.

You want to know the kind of integration I see in Chicago? I see "the ghetto" or "the hood". Primitive societies ridden with gangs and violence to the point that the Chicago Police don't even care about what happens there. And that is what happens when people from another place refuse to conform, they live in a totally different area and/or climate, but with the same education, violent outbreaks, etc, with a few new toys to play with. I'm not trying to sound arrogant, but how many times do you see somebody who has been living here for a generation and knows the ropes living in such a place? Maybe one in a thousand out of choice.

There is a reason countries were founded on principles like freedom, and it was to get the best out of life, but when the freedom is used to constrict freedom, well then where is the point? And that is my problem with the cultural change in pretty much every democratic country that is taking immigrants.

And then said "ghetto"-dwelling people complain...

And thus, we cannot simply let people have their way, we need to regulate the freedoms so the peole do not restrict it themselves.

[Thinker]

your putting us in one category and calling us primitive and violent. Sure its gang ridden but thats why america needs to stop and fix those places also the reason why most imagrants live there is becuse its cheap rent and I dont have alot of money. Tax money shouldnt be going on a war well never win but instead on enriching certain parts of the country and citys. I live in eastside L.a do I seem that primitive to you. Ya i know how it is my cousin died last year just becuase latin kings where in a war with nortenos is that my fault no its the goverment for not giving better funding to my police and programs like ymca or schools.

Edited by Thinker, 13 June 2007 - 20:41.

[Whitey]

Funny, I didn't take you for an LA guy, but even so, the ghetto is not just about cheap rent. Moving from a country with poor education and whatnot into a country completely opposite is a tough thing. That's why these hoods form. People want to be with their own race when they are newcomers, and when that happens, the old values just continue to spread without adopting the reasons for moving from the old county in the first place. What it is is dragging all of said countries problems into the next nation. This is the salad bowl idea and as all can see, it just doesn't work out for anybody. We should be a melting pot, all conforming, but due to insecurities, this doesn't work either.

In entering another countries boundaries, one should adopt that countries morals and values, not bring along their own. Because when that happens, we get a clash and crap like "the ghetto" springs up. Modern city mixed in with shanty homes and poor education.

And no, I am not putting all immigrants into a primitive and violent category. I am putting immigrants that are too dependent on their old culture primitive and violent. They leave their country because it is primitive and/or violent, no? They seek better education/economy/lifestyle. But when they arrive, they simply join in right where they were, in a state of lacking education and economy. They get just waht they had back home, only in a new locale.

[Nerdsturm]

I don't think that even if immigrants completely embraced American culture it would do much to improve their financial or social conditions. Knowing English is required for anyone to get a well paying job, but since almost public schools are taught solely in English, I can't see this as much of a problem for anyone but first-generation immigrants. Also, blacks, although to some extent they still embrace their African heritage instead of the dominate European influenced culture, still are considerably poorer and more prone to criminal activity than whites despite the fact that most of them have fully integrated into the same culture. What is far more important for immigrants to do than be willing embrace a Foreign culture is to properly prepare for and learn what type of life they are immigrating to. I know several Israelis who have come here and kept their own culture, but since their parents are well educated and came here legally they have done fine. Those who come here and move to ghettos can't possible expect a better life, even if they are willing to give the culture of the old one, because they still lack the skills, capital, or education to improve their's, regardless of where they go.