52 replies to this topic

[Dauth]

Well this is a semi political affair without being political and I look forward to getting my teeth into it.

So is anyone here such a close minded bastard that they think that women can't do the job as well as the male bishops do?

Apparently this will cause a rift with the Catholic Church, grand IIRC the Anglicans were formed when the Pope said no to a divorce, he hasn't said yes yet so I don't see what has changed, perhaps since the end of the violence in Northern Ireland (something I am very glad about) people have stopped caring who tells them how to talk to God.

Actually a worrying thought, how will the Islamic community react to this.

[Mbob61]

 Dauth, on 8 Jul 2008, 18:43, said:

So is anyone here such a close minded bastard that they think that women can't do the job as well as the male bishops do?

Not meaning to sound like a bastard here but i think thats a little hypocritical of you to say that.

 Dauth, on 25 Jun 2008, 0:34, said:

Women's Singles, other than the lecherous vote, I see no reason to watch this. Essentially two women will try to smack each other off the back of the court. Prize money annoys me too, either play best of 5 set or take 60% of the Men's prize money, I don't care which, but this has to change.

I know it doesn't exactly fit the point exactly but i think it shows what i am trying to say.

Back on topic - i see no problem with this at all and i have been wondering how long it would take for this too happen. We have finally decided that it is us who make our decisions and not "god"

Mike

[Dauth]

 mbob61, on 8 Jul 2008, 19:01, said:

 Dauth, on 8 Jul 2008, 18:43, said:

So is anyone here such a close minded bastard that they think that women can't do the job as well as the male bishops do?

Not meaning to sound like a bastard here but i think thats a little hypocritical of you to say that.

 Dauth, on 25 Jun 2008, 0:34, said:

Women's Singles, other than the lecherous vote, I see no reason to watch this. Essentially two women will try to smack each other off the back of the court. Prize money annoys me too, either play best of 5 set or take 60% of the Men's prize money, I don't care which, but this has to change.

I know it doesn't exactly fit the point exactly but i think it shows what i am trying to say.

Back on topic - i see no problem with this at all and i have been wondering how long it would take for this too happen. We have finally decided that it is us who make our decisions and not "god"

Mike

I am not preventing women from playing tennis, all I am asking for is decent treatment, if they wanted as much money as men then they should work as hard, if they don't want to work as hard then they can be paid the same proportion as the men.

My opinion about watching the tennis is merely how I wish to spend my time and there is no reason why I cannot have a preference for watching men's tennis. It's not like that male Bishops will evaporate when women get ordained.

[BeefJeRKy]

I asked my Christian Education teacher about this last year (I'm in a Catholic school so such a class is mandatory) and he told me the reason bishops and priests are always male and not female is because they represent Jesus Christ in performing their duties and it is strange for a woman to "represent" Christ. Honestly I can see a point in this argument but if you ask me, for a person who is deeply rooted in his faith, it wouldn't matter whether he is receiving a sermon from a man or a woman. I think that the main reason for this attitude by the Church is political.

[Ion Cannon!]

The reason woman bishops were so opposed is because some of the church authority figures are stuck in the past, the vatican even more so. The vatican says it will harm the church of englands relations with the vatican, do we care? Its way past the time we took orders from you traditionalist gits, its not the 1500's anymore.

I am for the change. The church has been losing its popularity but really it only has its self to blame by still conducting itself like its medieval times. This represents a change in attitudes and can only be good for the church of england.

[Shirou]

I despise the vatican and everything around it so I won't give in depth opinions about it, but I do respond ontopic that it's not that they think the women can't handle it, it's just like because in the catholic church, and almost any religion at that, women are just classified inferior to men.

A female bishop would break that ''law'', and so they are swinging their asses over it.

[smooder]

And whats with everyone bashing catholics here?

[Kichō]

 Scopejim, on 8 Jul 2008, 22:20, said:

I asked my Christian Education teacher about this last year (I'm in a Catholic school so such a class is mandatory) and he told me the reason bishops and priests are always male and not female is because they represent Jesus Christ in performing their duties and it is strange for a woman to "represent" Christ. Honestly I can see a point in this argument but if you ask me, for a person who is deeply rooted in his faith, it wouldn't matter whether he is receiving a sermon from a man or a woman. I think that the main reason for this attitude by the Church is political.

If that's true, correct me if I'm wrong but that seems Sexist.

[Dauth]

 smooder, on 10 Jul 2008, 13:49, said:

And whats with everyone bashing catholics here?

With a list of crimes comparable to any European country, they deserve it.

 Zhen Ji, on 10 Jul 2008, 13:50, said:

 Scopejim, on 8 Jul 2008, 22:20, said:

I asked my Christian Education teacher about this last year (I'm in a Catholic school so such a class is mandatory) and he told me the reason bishops and priests are always male and not female is because they represent Jesus Christ in performing their duties and it is strange for a woman to "represent" Christ. Honestly I can see a point in this argument but if you ask me, for a person who is deeply rooted in his faith, it wouldn't matter whether he is receiving a sermon from a man or a woman. I think that the main reason for this attitude by the Church is political.

If that's true, correct me if I'm wrong but that seems Sexist.

Catholics, like most religions are sexist, but you try taking them to court over it.

[Reaper94]

i'm not really religious but i will say, that i cant see why a woman cant do what a man can, i'm a modern teen (no i dont go out and start stabbing people, if you notice, a fair few of my posts are from like 10:00+ anyway, i dsont live in the age of "women are inferioir, you cant go to work cos you're female" all that bullshit is as i say; bullshit.

A woman is a human and so is a man therefor they deserve equal treatment and to be allowed to do the same jobs as men.

Just my opinion

[Shirou]

 smooder, on 10 Jul 2008, 14:49, said:

And whats with everyone bashing catholics here?

I'm not bashing catholics I'm bashing religion in general.

[CodeCat]

Then maybe you can explain why every religion and all its members need to be bashed?

[TehKiller]

Quote

With a list of crimes comparable to any European country, they deserve it.

Doing a crime and using religion as a shield doesnt make you a catholic. Also that statement looks a bit hypocritical.

Quote

i'm not really religious but i will say, that i cant see why a woman cant do what a man can, i'm a modern teen (no i dont go out and start stabbing people, if you notice, a fair few of my posts are from like 10:00+ anyway, i dsont live in the age of "women are inferioir, you cant go to work cos you're female" all that bullshit is as i say; bullshit.

A woman is a human and so is a man therefor they deserve equal treatment and to be allowed to do the same jobs as men.

Just my opinion

Religion and discrimination are 2 different things. In religion rules are set from the start and wont change. And this looks more like "Men are inferior to women" as they got more privelege than the men and feminists still request more.

As far as religion goes....basicaly a woman cant be a bishop. Period.

Edited by TehKiller, 10 July 2008 - 17:55.

[Dauth]

 TehKiller, on 10 Jul 2008, 18:55, said:

Quote

With a list of crimes comparable to any European country, they deserve it.

Doing a crime and using religion as a shield doesnt make you a catholic. Also that statement looks a bit hypocritical.

When they excommunicate Hitler I'll be more forgiving. All I'm saying is that the RC Church can be bashed just as much as Britain can, we don't have a glorious past. The Empire was built on a number of unpalatable systems and just as Britain has her crimes so does the RC Church. It becomes incredibly funny when the guy in charge is meant to be infallible. The advantage of the countries is that they can be criticised on what they do now, since most of the mistakes have been apologised for or undone. The Catholic Chruch just keeps making them.

[TehKiller]

Actually no thats ignorant ppl who think that its all the Church's fault (like Hitler is being considered as one of the Church's meanest ppl even though he was a demented fool who thought he was doing the right thing). Even by your theory you would bash Islam as a whole because of 9.11.? (note: this aint politics, its more opinion)

[Dauth]

 TehKiller, on 10 Jul 2008, 20:06, said:

Actually no thats ignorant ppl who think that its all the Church's fault (like Hitler is being considered as one of the Church's meanest ppl even though he was a demented fool who thought he was doing the right thing). Even by your theory you would bash Islam as a whole because of 9.11.? (note: this aint politics, its more opinion)

As a secular Atheist, I have a number of problems with Islam, however the biggest is the fact that if I state them there is a chance I get blown up.

The Church would have us in the Dark Ages if it had everything it's own way. I believe in progress, I am therefore polar opposite to the Church. BTW look at my red text , I will always argue and bashing the Church is a good start, there is a reason that it is known as the world's largest paedophile ring. My point is that Britain has an inglorious history, but we don't claim to be doing the work of God, nor do we claim to be infallible.

[BeefJeRKy]

 Zhen Ji, on 10 Jul 2008, 15:50, said:

 Scopejim, on 8 Jul 2008, 22:20, said:

I asked my Christian Education teacher about this last year (I'm in a Catholic school so such a class is mandatory) and he told me the reason bishops and priests are always male and not female is because they represent Jesus Christ in performing their duties and it is strange for a woman to "represent" Christ. Honestly I can see a point in this argument but if you ask me, for a person who is deeply rooted in his faith, it wouldn't matter whether he is receiving a sermon from a man or a woman. I think that the main reason for this attitude by the Church is political.

If that's true, correct me if I'm wrong but that seems Sexist.

Are you implying Jesus Christ was a female? The priest and all higher ranking preachers are all supposed to be spiritually representative of Jesus. That doesn't mean that a nun is less important or faithful than a priest, it's basically administrative. I still think it's time we moved on though.

As Dauth metioned, the Church kept its followers in the dark to control their beliefs. Today it's nearly impossible to do that, so I think it should play an ethical role in society. Of course if more scandals keep popping up, noone will trust them. Why is it that there are so many pedophilic priests?

[The Wandering Jew]

 Scopejim, on 11 Jul 2008, 6:53, said:

 Zhen Ji, on 10 Jul 2008, 15:50, said:

 Scopejim, on 8 Jul 2008, 22:20, said:

I asked my Christian Education teacher about this last year (I'm in a Catholic school so such a class is mandatory) and he told me the reason bishops and priests are always male and not female is because they represent Jesus Christ in performing their duties and it is strange for a woman to "represent" Christ. Honestly I can see a point in this argument but if you ask me, for a person who is deeply rooted in his faith, it wouldn't matter whether he is receiving a sermon from a man or a woman. I think that the main reason for this attitude by the Church is political.

If that's true, correct me if I'm wrong but that seems Sexist.

Are you implying Jesus Christ was a female? The priest and all higher ranking preachers are all supposed to be spiritually representative of Jesus. That doesn't mean that a nun is less important or faithful than a priest, it's basically administrative. I still think it's time we moved on though.

As Dauth metioned, the Church kept its followers in the dark to control their beliefs. Today it's nearly impossible to do that, so I think it should play an ethical role in society. Of course if more scandals keep popping up, noone will trust them. Why is it that there are so many pedophilic priests?

Because of the so-called "Act of Celibacy" that makes a priest very vulnerable to temptations.

P.S. Anglican history tells Henry VIII's request for divorce from Catherine of Aragon in favor of Anne Boleyn. When the pope in that time (Which was debatable who that was. Many say it was not Clement VII) rejected it, it was up to Henry VIII to put the matter into his hands.
P.P.S. A king without a son/legal heir in that time smelled disaster.

P.P.P.S. Buddhist monks were rumored to be highly celibate. Maybe the priests/nuns/abbots/abbesses might learn a thing or two.

Edited by The Wandering Jew, 11 July 2008 - 04:24.

[Alias]

There is one thing I still do not get about this place. We cannot share our views of other countries but we can bash their beliefs?

Either allow politics here or ban religion, because it's starting to look a bit hypocritical.

[The Wandering Jew]

 Alias, on 11 Jul 2008, 12:17, said:

There is one thing I still do not get about this place. We cannot share our views of other countries but we can bash their beliefs?

Either allow politics here or ban religion, because it's starting to look a bit hypocritical.

It is a stated fact that all organizations, whether it be political, religious, academic, scientific, profit, or non-profit, one way or another, there'll be politicking involved.

Well, it's up to Dauth if he'll allow politics or not.

[Alias]

No, it's up to the administration.

Dauth I feel is one of the main perpetrators of hypocrisy here, he sees one mention of politics and a thread is locked, but then in a different thread he freely bashes religion.

Edited by Alias, 11 July 2008 - 05:03.

[Dauth]

 Alias, on 11 Jul 2008, 5:59, said:

No, it's up to the administration.

Dauth I feel is one of the main perpetrators of hypocrisy here, he sees one mention of politics and a thread is locked, but then in a different thread he freely bashes religion.

I don't see flame wars over religion, and I have no problems saying that I would discuss internal politics, but international politics is where everyone goes for a flame.

If we didn't discuss religion then it pretty much closes the PC, since you'll have a very hard time finding something that isn't close to religion. Alias is right is freely bash religion, and I will always do so until I am told it is not appropriate for me to voice my opinions. I will also point out that whenever I bash a religion I am always willing to back up the bash with logic. This is something that is never seen when two people have a politics flame war.

I would also like you to prove me wrong about either of my main comments about Islam and the RC Church, the violence and the dark ages respectively.

[Alias]

Bashing religion is still hate, which falls against the rules. I do not mind you criticising religion(s), but I do mind bigotry and general hate against religion and that is what I have seen here.

[Dauth]

 Alias, on 11 Jul 2008, 10:17, said:

Bashing religion is still hate, which falls against the rules. I do not mind you criticising religion(s), but I do mind bigotry and general hate against religion and that is what I have seen here.

Fair enough, I'm not going to claim I am perfect, I'll leave that to someone else. I know things on the internet can be misconstrued so in light of your comments I will now try to be explicit when I criticise religions.

[The Wandering Jew]

 Alias, on 11 Jul 2008, 17:17, said:

Bashing religion is still hate, which falls against the rules. I do not mind you criticising religion(s), but I do mind bigotry and general hate against religion and that is what I have seen here.

Are you referring to what I stated before:

Quote

P.P.P.S. Buddhist monks were rumored to be highly celibate. Maybe the priests/nuns/abbots/abbesses might learn a thing or two.

That was meant as a joke. No hate intended.

Edit: It seems to me that our friends who follow Islamic faith have not yet replied here (or show their opinion).

Edited by The Wandering Jew, 12 July 2008 - 04:44.