691 replies to this topic

[BeefJeRKy]

Nem, on 19 Oct 2009, 19:10, said:

Why not cut out the middle man? Get rid of the sever and connect directly to other players. Peer to Peer is the future, get used to it. =/

P2P is good for casual gamers as it nets them easy instant action with other players. However the problem arises when you discover that worldwide, we have a desperate lack of bandwidth on average. P2P is good for the lucky few who have amazingly stable connections. A dedicated server ensures that games run smoothly for most players online. And I mean, if they've jacked up the cost of the game, at least use the extra cash for dedicated servers. Tbh, CoD6 will sell so much based on hype alone, so I hardly think it's fair to completely remove the dedicated server option. Finally, I think one reason for removing it is to get rid of private high XP servers for leveling up.

Also, it seems custom maps and mods have been thrown out the window as well according to that Steam thread that was posted earlier.

[TehKiller]

Nem, on 19 Oct 2009, 17:10, said:

Why not cut out the middle man? Get rid of the sever and connect directly to other players. Peer to Peer is the future, get used to it. =/

If P2P is the future then why did it died in the past?

Ignorance wont really get anything far

btw Scope...not sure if you heard about the status of CoD1.... there never has been any kind of modding/mapping support for it

Edited by TehKiller, 19 October 2009 - 17:57.

[BeefJeRKy]

Well TehKiller, you usually you make progress as the series advances

[TehKiller]

My point was that there will always be a way to edit/mod/customise/whatever the game

[BeefJeRKy]

If IW doesn't officially allow it, wouldn't that be illegal?

[TehKiller]

Nope...they just wont support it (meaning no SDK). As long as you dont touch the engine of the game its all perfectly legal (except in cases if you are trying to hack in someone else's models without persmission and distribute that mod)

[Nem]

Chyros, on 19 Oct 2009, 13:02, said:

Nem, on 19 Oct 2009, 18:10, said:

Why not cut out the middle man? Get rid of the sever and connect directly to other players. Peer to Peer is the future, get used to it. =/

A couple dozen console-based members have been banned from the IW forums for fanning the flames for PC gamers in much the same way you are acting right now, just so you know.

PC gamers are used to a very high standard of online gaming since the PC is and has in fact always been THE platform of choice for all the hardcore gamers. Not only that, the PC gaming community thrives on a high degree of tightly-knit, community-based (or clan-based) type of gameplay that is unfamiliar to console players. If you, as an obvious console gamer, need more info, I strongly suggest you turn to the MW2 IW forums, where there are about a dozen topics (the other odd hundred or so have been deleted by the moderating team) trying to explain to console gamers what the PC gamers are missing now.

So you thought instead of answering my question, You would inform me about how much better your platform is then mine, then ask me to go read another forum, would be met with anything other then a negative response? Remind me, who is fanning the flames again? If you want to address something, address why P2P isn't a good idea and not your obvious fanaticism. Dedicated servers will eventually die out, and you disliking that will do little to impede that fact.

Oh and just to be clear, I was stating why logically this was the right move by IW, sorry that I didn't factor in your emotions before posting. Hey, I'm sorry you didn't consider mine as well.

Edited by Nem, 20 October 2009 - 07:10.

[KiraSama]

Quote

address why P2P isn't a good idea and not your obvious fanaticism.

and this from somebody who has a quote in the signature cleary attacking PC players? and the only argument in favor to P2P is "is the future of gaming because i say so"? and ignoring everything else about stability of conection, bandwich around the world and comunity base?

Quote

I was stating why logically this was the right move by IW

yeah, totally, cut options for players, claim total control of the game and increase the price, the most logical option........to what exactly? increase piracy so they can cry about it?

[Chyros]

Nem, on 20 Oct 2009, 5:36, said:

Chyros, on 19 Oct 2009, 13:02, said:

Nem, on 19 Oct 2009, 18:10, said:

Why not cut out the middle man? Get rid of the sever and connect directly to other players. Peer to Peer is the future, get used to it. =/

A couple dozen console-based members have been banned from the IW forums for fanning the flames for PC gamers in much the same way you are acting right now, just so you know.

PC gamers are used to a very high standard of online gaming since the PC is and has in fact always been THE platform of choice for all the hardcore gamers. Not only that, the PC gaming community thrives on a high degree of tightly-knit, community-based (or clan-based) type of gameplay that is unfamiliar to console players. If you, as an obvious console gamer, need more info, I strongly suggest you turn to the MW2 IW forums, where there are about a dozen topics (the other odd hundred or so have been deleted by the moderating team) trying to explain to console gamers what the PC gamers are missing now.

So you thought instead of answering my question, You would inform me about how much better your platform is then mine, then ask me to go read another forum, would be met with anything other then a negative response? Remind me, who is fanning the flames again? If you want to address something, address why P2P isn't a good idea and not your obvious fanaticism. Dedicated servers will eventually die out, and you disliking that will do little to impede that fact.

Oh and just to be clear, I was stating why logically this was the right move by IW, sorry that I didn't factor in your emotions before posting. Hey, I'm sorry you didn't consider mine as well.

Perhaps it wasn't very clear what I posted. Instead of trying to compare your platform to mine, I was comparing the matchmaking system to dedicated servers. And I can assure you my fanaticism is not very obvious since you should see what OTHER pc gamers have done when the news came out.

The matchmaking system has the following disadvantages compared to the dedicated server system:
-considerably worse pings, especially for everybody outside the US
-low clan/community support
-no custom content possible
-DLC exploitation
-angry 12-year-olds are randomly promoted to server admins

The fact that merely TWO DAYS after the interview over 90,000 people have signed the petition (and still rising rapidly) should be a good indication of how much a downgrade this is to PC gamers. As an analogy, consider that you as a console user would need a null modem cable connection to play with people "online", except that you can't do it with people you know. That's the kind of downgrade PC gamers are getting thrown in the face. And I'm quite startled why you would consider this to be a good move from IW since it doesn't even affect you.

EDIT: mind you, it will probably still be playable, that's true. But of the fact it's on obvious downgrade, there is no doubt.

Edited by Chyros, 20 October 2009 - 11:13.

[Wanderer]

The amount of ppl who have signed the petition will hit 100k in a few hours. It's a weird move to take something away that pc-gamers take for granted. Apparently fourzerotwo will take the message to the developers and show them the petition. Keep your fingers crossed....

[BeefJeRKy]

Think of it this way. 100k players is easily anywhere between 7 and 8 million dollars depending on the people who would buy the hardened or prestige editions. They can't ignore that many people This move kinda re-inforces my idea of the evil Activision CEO.

If this doesn't fall through, you'll see me playing BF:BC2 for sure.

[Lord Atlantis]

You know the big change between dedicated server and peer to peer is they merged the dedicated server and the game, instead of having them be seperate, and the game chooses the game host on his connection history and how good his connection is. And if the game gets it wrong, it will migrate host to a better host. Who may or may not be a whiney 12 year old, but as of late I haven't ran into them very much. But the game does recognize where the world you are in with your IP, and won't connect you to a game if the connection ping is worse enough. Worse case scenario for Eurpoeans is the system will throw you into a room that is hosted on the easter easboard of the united states. Yeah, the ping may not be the best, but the connection should still be good. I imagine that IW has programming in the system to include the European base players.

Sure its an obvious downgrade to what the PC players are used to, but if they are trying to bring Matchmaking to PC, then they will include the party system so that you and a party of friends can travel between games. For the clan and community based people, all they would have to do is if they want internal games against each other they would do private matches where the host of the game controls the settings, but with this addition to the matchmaking system, all you would need to do is party up and then go and play against another team of players, whether they be clan or not. During those fights, you may win, or you may lose, but you still learn what the rest of the gaming community as a whole is playing.

Also, I have yet to hear how the PC multiplayer is going to be built upon. Console multiplayer has been showed in large amounts, but not how the PC is. Since they are going to be making a matchmaking system similiar to consoles, there will be friends list support and party support.

You can do the same stuff that you would do in a dedicated server, its just more dynamic.

Sure, IW may not change their approach and not have dedicated servers and thats going to suck, but just some positive, even in a huge negative realm right now, to take away from this. It isn't as horrible as it seems, well to some it is, but speaking from years of console experience, if that is how the system will work then here is some general info about it.

I'm not trying to fan any flames here, I am just trying to help bring both sides together in a compromising way. Thats all.

Edited by Lord Atlantis, 20 October 2009 - 17:31.

[BeefJeRKy]

Actually, if they could allow cross-platform multiplayer with this change, then it would be quite epic though I suppose they woud have announced such a thing and probably hyped him. I remember there was an Xbox game that did this (forgot its name but it had guns and magic )

[TheDR]

Viseur, on 20 Oct 2009, 18:44, said:

Actually, if they could allow cross-platform multiplayer with this change, then it would be quite epic though I suppose they woud have announced such a thing and probably hyped him. I remember there was an Xbox game that did this (forgot its name but it had guns and magic )

It was the highly unpopular Shadow Run (They made you get GFWL gold, which costs money... so it didn't work that well ).

The problem with PC vs Console is the major disadvantage of controllers not being as accurate as a mouse, which would mean even the best of the best console players wouldn't be able to hold a candle to the PC elite. It could be cool to see, but it could cause problems.

[BeefJeRKy]

Ah yeah that's what it was called. Cheers Doc.

[KiraSama]

http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/200...r-response.aspx

apparently they dont want to put dedicate servers because: it would just "bifurcate the community."

i call bull screments and they want total control

[BeefJeRKy]

KiraSama, on 20 Oct 2009, 21:44, said:

http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/200...r-response.aspx

apparently they dont want to put dedicate servers because: it would just "bifurcate the community."

i call bull screments and they want total control

That has to be one of the lamer reasons I've heard.

I really hope that IW can make this matchmaking system really effective.

[Lord Atlantis]

However that article did point out that having this matchmaking system unifies the whole gaming community instead of the isolated colonies that the dedicated servers would create. If a clan only wants to play clan matches in their own server, that means that they have their own personal community that only they play with. All the matchmaking system does is level the playing field so that everyone can play with everyone. Every player can still do what they originally did with the dedicated server multiplayer system in the matchmaking system, minus the mods and deep custom rules. But in all reality, who is going to play with the mods all of the time? If you think a certain weapon is OP'ed, you solve it my making it how it should be. But why not let IW know of what you think is wrong so that they can fix it for everyone.

EDIT: cause one thing that IW has been doing has been taking all of the CnC that they have gotten about MW and have implimented it into MW2. Hell, the matchmaking system might be amazing for all we know. But it isn't november 10th yet so we don't know yet.

But I'll definitely be adding to this from the console side of multiplayer to see if this is comparible on standard levels.

Edited by Lord Atlantis, 20 October 2009 - 19:09.

[KiraSama]

Quote

If a clan only wants to play clan matches in their own server, that means that they have their own personal community that only they play with.

and the point is: thats bad because....?

[Lord Atlantis]

Just an example of the sever communities. Its just in my opinion that everyone being able to easily play with everyone would be better.

But others do have their opinion on this and I do respect that. All I am trying to do is show that this system, if implimented properally, may not be that bad.

[Wanderer]

http://www.fourzerotwo.com/?p=745

Check this out

[D.K.]

This means, I can freely download the MW2. There is no point in paying the whole price for non-existent MP.

[KiraSama]

Lord Atlantis, on 20 Oct 2009, 21:48, said:

Just an example of the sever communities. Its just in my opinion that everyone being able to easily play with everyone would be better.

But others do have their opinion on this and I do respect that. All I am trying to do is show that this system, if implimented properally, may not be that bad.

in my opinion a system than force you to play by a set of rules set up in stone by a company compared to a system in were you can choose how and where to play is very hard than it would be better

[ΓΛPTΘΓ]

This is gonna fail, so much.

It seems the developers does not understand PC gaming at all, and try to grab as much money as possible from consoles.

[Lord Atlantis]

I do find it interesting that all of the people who are being optimistic about this new system are being shatted on. (according to the four zero two.com page)